Saturday, October 11, 2008

Advising Torres

Host: Let’s look at what his Pachuca teammates told Paco Torres before and after his decision to play for the U.S.

Torres: Well, I mostly talked with Gabriel Caballero and Miguel Calero. I think they’re supporting me in every way. Correa also told me a lot of things – that I made the correct decision. I think my teammates are supporting me 100 percent. I’ve learned a lot from them.

Narrator: Jaime Correa and Gabriel Caballero have admitted to talking with Torres about his decision and helping him come to the choice to play for the U.S.

Caballero: “Mexico waited until the last moment. They should have called him earlier. He decided to make the choice that was in his control. He’s got a lot of qualities. That’s going to help him to triumph. I think the Mexican team did lose a good player.”

Correa: “He held out for a little while, waiting to see if Mexico would call him. But he was thinking about World Cup qualifying games and the upcoming World Cup and he finally chose and I think made the best choice.”

Enrique Meza was the first person to seek out Torres about the decision and gave him the opposite council of his teammates.

Meza: He said yes to the U.S. before he ever heard from Mexico. We all told him to wait, but he felt a certain impatience because of the upcoming World Cup. The last time I talked to him about it, he told me, “Prof, I gave my word already. I have to keep it, because my word is important.”

Host: Gringo Torres also said that when he talked to Calero, Calero told him to wait for a call from the Mexican national team. The young Pachuca player made his decision in the midst of differing advice.

Then the panel argues. They mention Orozco and Camoranesi. They mention Torres is not a regular starter for Pachuca. They discuss how Torres didn’t go to the Olympics, despite the invite of the U.S. That should have been a sign, the panel argues, that Mexico should have taken him more seriously. Basically, the argument is, “Cap ‘im! Figure out later if he’s any good.”

They mention that Bradley sees potential in him and the panel expects Torres to play in the World Cup. They fault not so much Ericksson, but Jesus “Chucho” Ramirez for not brining Torres in to any youth team matches.


Matthew said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Matthew said...

Thanks for the translation! There's been a lot of confusion about this development—most of the stories say Torres was conflicted about the decision for a while, but in all his quotes he says he's wanted to play for the U.S. his whole life. I guess those two aren't mutually exclusive. Oh well, doesn't matter anymore!

soy said...

im just soooo glad the USMNT is making strides at diversity. they've come a looooong way.

A.C. said...

Diversity? The U.S. often has a diverse team, with Hugo Perez and Martin Vasquez among others. Martin was especially interesting, because he had played for El Tri. Back when the rules were different, he was allowed to switch over once he became an American citizen. But Mexican fans didn't really care about that because Vasquez was older, and the U.S. wasn't considered any good, so they didn't have a problem with him playing for the U.S.

soy said...

id like to agree wity you AC and i tried to find as many "minorities" (for lack of a better word)through the years, but there just so few.

sure there's players like martin vasquez, hugo perez, and clavijo who are either naturalized or from another era, but i grew up in a more recent era where it was hard to identify with the USMNT.
just compare the u-23 player pool to the current mens team pool and the difference is very encouraging.

jon e said...

@ soy

Depends what you mean by "diversity" and "minority," I guess. Not as many latinos in general and chicanos in particular have played for the USMNT as I'd like, but in terms of nationality and ethnicity, the US team has been pretty mixed for as long as I can remember. And, given soccer's status as the "foreign" game, I'd be willing to guess that it's been true since the beginning.

East River said...

Tab Ramos, Balboa, former captian Claudio Reyna, David Regis, Ernie Stewart, Eddie Pope, Cobie Jones, and Mark Chung to name a few over the years. I think people will be surprise how many members of the national team have been of South American Latin decent. The problem has been tapping into the Mexican American and African talent pools inside the US. Granted Regis and Stewart were American only by citizenship but so are some of the players El Tri ahs targeted and gotten lately.

East River said...

Just wondering to myself but I wonder if this would be an issue the way it is if Edgar Castillo had not locked down a spot in El Tri 1st team considerations. It was 1 thing for him to get capped by Mexico but when he started appearing regularly and playing well the US really understood its mistake in over looking US citizens (Mexican-Americans) playing in the Mexican legaue. It seems bound to happen eventually, but still I find it all interesting how US Soccer's scouts just completely ignored these guys until the last year or so.

A.C. said...

It depends on what you consider ignored - Sammy Ochoa played for the U.S. in the u20 World Cup in 2005. Jesus Padilla was invited for the 2007 edition and turned the U.S. down. Orozco was brought in, though. Yes, the U.S. missed out on Castillo, but it's not as if all players in Mexico who are U.S. eligible have been ignored.

East River said...

From what I can gather about the likes of Ochoa is that he was well known as a player coming out of high school, there was a whole buzz about the Ochoa brothers, so they were known to scouts before they left for Mexico. Whereaas, Castillo and Torres were both under the radar as potential US senior team prospects. Castillo's capping changed everything. Torres has played for Pachuca what 5 seasons? Never even a youth call until this summer. Same can be said for Orozco. So yeah thoses two were ignored until Castillo.

BlueWhiteLion said...

I am wondering about the whole "gringo torres" thing. I don't know how it plays among native Mexicans, but it sounds a bit derogatory to me. Unprofessional. Am I wrong?

Not unlike German press using a leftover from WWII days and calling our team the "US boys." Although Gringo Torres sounds even worse. I have rarely heard the word "Gringo" in a positive way. By rarely, I mean "never."

Anonymous said...

bluewhitelion, you're grasping at straws. It can be an endearing term. Latin culture is different, don't try to understand it.

BlueWhiteLion said...

Not sure I am grasping at straws, just asking for input. Latin culture is quite varied, to be sure. Even those who say "Latin" can't define what "Latin" is, and some who are categorized as "Latin" object to that term--just as disagreement of "Hispanic." Culture is weird, yes. Miami and Europe have taught me that. Still, I have a question. Someone with real insight can give it a try and shed some light on it, if possible. Understanding come partly from inquiry. Anyway, anonymous, I gather you say it CAN be an endearing term? Okay, well thanks. I had never heard it that way--I am learning something new.

Anonymous said...

bluewhitelion, the term "gringo" can be used as endearing, and I would say I've heard it used as an endearing term most often than not. By the way, there is another Mexican soccer player, Jose "El Gringo" Castro, who plays for Club America. Not sure why they call him "gringo", but again it's not used in a deragory way.

Anonymous said...

bluewhitelion, in Spanish speaking cultures it is quite common to give nicknames to people. Often these nicknames are factual descriptions of the person which people in other cultures might find offensive, such as calling someone "El Gordo" (the fat one). Or think of the TV show "Ugly Betty" which is an adaptation of a Mexican(?) telenovela.

Additionally, although the word Gringo can be used with an offensive connotation, it is not inherent in the term. Although no one is really certain of the origin of the term, its use derives from the lack of a good term for those people from the USA. Americans/americanos is not much liked because all people from the Americas (North and South) feel that term should apply to them. The Spanish term "Estadounidenses" (forgive me if i've mangles this; I'm not a native Spanish speaker) is occasionally used. It would roughly translate as "United States-ians". However, as the official name of Mexico is the United States of Mexico many Mexicans feel that term could apply to them as well.

Rony said...

ESPN Deportes Hector Huerta is pure garbage.

Once again, he resorts to yellowpage journalism.

Here are the FACTS:

Jesus Ramirez (Mexican Youth NT instructor) did scout Torres and indeed called him up on 2 occasions.

Torres attended a preseason for the u-20 squad, but did not make the final cut.


I wish Torres the best of luck.

With that being said, I disagree totally with what that panel had to say.

I think it is unethical for a federation to cap a player with the sole intention of retaining a player from getting capped from another country. The panel insinuated that on a couple occasions.

However, I do agree with their assessment about Torres. He does have talent, but I dont think he should be capped when he is not even a starter with Pachuca.